Neato lithium ion battery revisited

News and information about the Neato XV-11 Robotic Vacuum. All discussion and troubleshooting questions go here.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby redpoint5 » December 23rd, 2013, 9:20 pm

I'm surprised by the relative lack of interest in this. The lithium ion batteries are cheap enough to experiment with, and I wouldn't mind having them even if the test were a failure.

The only thing holding me back at this point is the lack of cell balancing circuitry that the Germans were using. If someone could give me a decent balancing circuit, or link me to one I could purchase online, I'd do this test and report back here.

The NiMH batteries don't appear to be the appropriate technology for this application, or at the very least the charge/discharge program was not properly optimized for battery health.
redpoint5
Robot Groupie
 
Posts: 54
Joined: December 20th, 2013, 4:06 pm

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby vic7767 » December 23rd, 2013, 9:34 pm

There is a lot of interest in this LI-ion option for the Neato. The issue that has been identified is the fact that the charging firmware does not like the high impedance presented when the LI-ion Power Control Board decides the LI-ion cell has enough charge and opens the charging path. The secondary issue is the lack of a cell balance circuit for the twin packs. The German PCB design to fool the charging firmware is evidently difficult to order and be shipped to the US. So the little parts to get a working solution (German PCB, and balancing circuit, and Power control board) have a few hurdles to overcome before a hack will be tested in the Neato.
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 14917
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 23rd, 2013, 10:35 pm

link me to one I could purchase online, I'd do this test


[edit] Did you mean completely assembled battery packs, or the components referenced previously?

As previously posted page 3, the German distributor site is http://www.elv.de/lithium-polymer-lipo-%20...%20usatz.html

[edit] seems part no longer carried 12/24/13 -- see later post.

While in German language, you can see the usual add-to-cart lower right.
In the cart, a Paypal button at the lower right enters your usual account in English, and should transmit the shipping address. Didn't buy it but got that far, so don't see the problem. Maybe paypal doesn't link back properly, or they don't ship international? (unusual in Europe with many countries in continent). Shipping transatlantic can be costly.
You can also copy pieces of this site into Google's translator to interpret, good on simple commercial language. The check boxes aren't needed, for example. ELV is also the name of a German paypal competitor.

Four balancers, one for each cell in dual two-cell packs. See prior posts for cells of interest, wiring etc. Developer of the several year old balancer, TimTaler, reported charging with 2600mah unprotected cells, giving an expected 50 minute run time, consistent with the less than usual capacity (which can go to 90 minutes or more). Larger and protected cells were noted.
Last edited by glnc222 on December 26th, 2013, 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby redpoint5 » December 24th, 2013, 11:59 pm

I did translate and read through the German post on this, and someone in this thread said they attempted to purchase the German balance circuit, but it would not allow them to complete the order. Gordon's reverse engineering of the circuit was impressive, but incomplete. If someone with more electrical engineering know-how than me would look at this, I'm sure a simple solution would present itself.

50min run time is fine by me, since with a stock battery my house requires 2 runs to complete anyhow (~90min). Barely over a year for battery life is shameful. My Neato, running twice per week, lasted a little over a year until the battery suddenly dropped to 5min run time.
redpoint5
Robot Groupie
 
Posts: 54
Joined: December 20th, 2013, 4:06 pm

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 26th, 2013, 4:19 am

German Robotics Forum Thread

Discussion of the Taler balancer and Neato found at German Roboter-Forum :"Neato Lithium Ionen Upgrade" http://www.roboter-forum.com/showthread.php?5804-Neato-Lithium-Ionen-Upgrade
It is clear they are talking Neato's and not Vorwerks.

Poster Herr Hausman assembled packs with the akku-balancer and distributed a number to other members who reported good results. They may still be offered for sale, not sure. Mentions just a hobby.

Another member posted his own pack photo:
LiOnPack.jpg

Herr Hausman's photos require joining the forum to see, haven't done. Something in his posting links instead of the pics themselves.

I ran much of the thread through Google's AI translator, which has two funny quirks:
it is too stupid to know the standard word order inversion between English and German, so can sometimes write like a missive from Yoda in starwars.
It amusingly translates some German term for vacuuming as "sucking". All their Neato's suck well (for German speakers, the English is more applied to drinking through a straw). Well, the British call vacuuming "Hoovering" after the inventor of it all (who was originally in buggy whips, and got pushed into new areas by the automobile -- unless that was Singer, I forget).

Most of it is repeated questions or compliments; a longer testimonial:
-------------
ch would like to post a short review on all undecided .
I had ordered some days ago about the Samsung 14 cells and the ELV Balancer and wanted to make these modifications himself . After the components were there, I had previously, again with work colleagues kept short consultation , of which I knew that they are active in the local model flying club go. The result was sobering : from the conversion I was discouraged , it was also found nobody who wanted ran there. Me first crept doubt whether I should make myself really .
After I had gained the impression here and in the U.S. forum that house man knows what he's talking about and especially what he does , a message went out to him.
After exchange address , I have put all the components in the package and on Tuesday (3.12 . ) Sent on their way .
When I arrived this Monday ( 9:12 . ) Home last night , there was a package in front of my door .
For installation and first test run I got here today.

It is in my Neato XV -21 to the to the Pet Brush ( U.S. version ) . The new battery packs fit just so pure in the bays. After installing the Neato wanted to the charging station ( about 1 minute) . During this period I have 18V can be read on the meter. After the loading process was completed visually by the LEDs , I measured it again and it was , as expected, all good.

Now for the test run :
In the flat laminate the rest is mainly laid with tiles. For this purpose, a rugs in the bathroom.
The term after the first test run was exactly 66 minutes before he switched off the fan and started to go towards charging station - a dream!
Interestingly, I found the display on the Neato . It was no longer visible bars on the display , but he was still some time before he wanted to go back to the charging station . The retraction was no problem at all , ie it was still enough battery power available to them to drive ( about 2 minutes to go there ) . Docking went smoothly .

He is currently attached to the charging station to refuel .
I am far more than happy with all


Herr Hausman made a few technical replies of possible interest to engineers and hobbyists, extracted together:

The entire control and regulation (balancer, etc.) I have integrated in the battery pack. The circuit is designed so that the lithium ion capacity is never fully exploited. According to the data of the battery then holds 5000-10.000 cycles.
Excessive heating of the load balancer to the end was my fear , so I had already thought of this provision , but they were not even necessary.
The Neato charge controller has a Delta - Peak cut-off , ie with the NIMH batteries rises at the end of charging, the temperature significantly , thus the internal resistance suddenly rises again , the voltage drops across the cell -> loading is initiated.
The same happens now fortunately in the LiOn battery with balance . -> 8.4V (threshold value for balancer) reached end of charging , balancer is active, the cell voltage decreases , Neato finished charging. In addition, the controller has a timer -controlled shutdown.
In addition, the charging current at the end ( > 8V ) is not more 1A, but is in the range mAh (~ 100mA ) .
I've played through it countless times , the balancers as well as the batteries during and after charging not warm.Sobald the cells are full, the controller switches off.
No comparison to the NIMH , which are considerably warm during charging.
" Why do I get longer run times than with the NIMH batteries? "
The voltage discharge curve of LION is significantly flatter than NIMH , ie so that the voltage remains at a high level longer than NIMH , which has a majority of its capacity below 1.2V .

The favorable test battery pack is already taken. Should there as well test operation under Lio-fuel succeed, I can offer you to create additional battery packs (for who do not want to solder yourself)
Since I'm doing this as a hobby, but I was only able to complete a Neato battery pack per week. (Loading, prebalancen, shrinking, Molex connector, temperature sensor, etc. ..)
Currently, the total price is (pure material costs excluding shipping) from 70 € (varies slightly depending on what the Lion costs just.) ([edit] $96 Dec.2013; ELV 4-balancers $50-$60)
Clear on ebay you can get the cell cheaper, but without guarantee of origin. Also switch the cheap ebay-balancer from china man (about 1 € each) significantly slower than those from Europe, and developed in DE ... and have a greater tolerance with respect to the switching voltage at 4.1 and 4.25V on.
The Balancer used have installed an additional MOSFET that is completely off the circuit after charging, so that there is almost no quiescent current flows. (Cheap ebay Balancer waive this)
A total of 4 pieces. 2 per page. Is more used for what is in principle also place, they will not fully load the Neato under some circumstances , as it not only invites voltage controlled ( delta peak) but also time-controlled.
soldering:
Lithium ion batteries are permanently damaged if you herumlötet to long at the terminals , since the heat then passes into the interior , which can also lead to self-ignition .
I use this one more expensive JBC soldering station that the tip has a PTC resistor , so that it can heat up to soldering temperature almost all solder joints within 2sec.punktuell . ( http://www.jbctools.com/premium-category-11.html )
Solder is normal solder (lead free ) with additional solder paste.
Balancer:
Any surplus energy would be converted into heat. Here, however, the current is how I use the balancer ( Just as they are equipped from the factory ) is limited to approximately 300mA . This leads to a maximum power dissipation of 1.3Watt per Balancer.
The charging scheme from Neato can not achieve more than 8.5V under load. For me it has never gerreicht to the anything has really heated.
Very different from the original NIMH , the temperature may increase noticeably only by chemical processes involved in loading ...
Furthermore Samsung brand cells exhibit from a high inherent safety , which is also reflected in ruggedness tests:
(detail previously posted here by TimTaler, balancer developer several years ago, before Neato's).
[edit] some confusion here: Taler posted he developed the LiOn Neato kit -- not necessarilly the old balancer component. So Taler and Hausman likely the same contributor in the two forums. Apologies for any misrepresentations.

[edit] Note Hausman's use of a fancy soldering station for rapid soldering wires to LIthium cells without over-heating, maybe more hazard than with Nickel. More expensive cells are supplied with spot welded tabs, always used in commercial packs. Someone else mentioned using separately applied flux when soldering to cells, same as manual surface mount soldering, which also speeds, and solder paste used there. It would be handy to use some kind of clip for easy cell replacement, I gather usually avoided to prevent corrosion wear (possibly a hazard with heat and arcing with LiOn compared to Nickel); I once had contacts on a Roomba battery corrode over several years to the point of unit failure. Contact cleaner and prerservative chemicals are sold.

Member PeteX reporting bad results here seems primarily a German forum member, same handle, who copied us his conclusion (mentioned over there), but his description there clearly omits any use of balancers.

Now if we could just post in proper universal Latin, maybe we could get this straight -- as long as you are at Oxford University maybe.

For my two bits, I would note these flashlight LiOn batteries are normally charged in a separate charger putting them in parallel. Many specialized IC's are supplied for making these chargers. The main problem solved by the balancer is charging in series, like maybe circuits in laptop batteries. It does two things: implement a switch to convert the series network into parallel when charging, and back to series for discharging. Unlike Nickel, LiOn cannot be charged in series because they cut off charging current when full, leaving cells farther along orphaned. Second, it regulates voltages on the cells to get them equally charged. In addition, the switch works to defeat the error detection in Neato's procedure expecting Nickel battery behavior without sudden cutoffs in charging current produced by LiOn, maybe just a byproduct of the switching. As member Gordon remarked, the balancer does not include protection circuits found very miniaturized inside some more expensive LiOn cells, with TimTaler relying on the equivalent functions in Neato (with thermistor and polyfuse packed with the cells). I prefer duplication backup. Beyond that I need an engineer.
[edit] sort of like the universal interface, connecting anything to everything -- but if used in Europe, you'd need an adapter.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 26th, 2013, 8:56 pm

LBA-1 Balancer No Longer Carried at ELV
Problem reported with the ELV website may be that it no longer lists the LBA-1 balancer for sale, just a link to its old article on it. The link posted previously here linked to a catalog listing a few days ago, but now is redirected to the ELV home page, and catalog search reports only the article link.
It is possible stock was exhausted and not re-manufactured. It appears to be a six year old item, so not surprising for a PC Board. Maybe publication for Neato caused a rush on the remaining supplies. So old unlikely to be found elsewhere, if it was ever anyplace else, not likely. The whole technology in the area has advanced with more IC products etc., so may be obsolete in terms of main markets, compared to specialized Neato application.

[edit] component costs
Cost of components in the parts list for four circuits, if on perfboard say, is $27-30 at Digi-Key -- half the assembled price ELV used to list, not unusual. PCB making around $35 minimum four. Not that much help if hand soldering one set, so few parts, some surface mount. Might be able to put battery clips on a 2-unit perfboard as well.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby Gordon » December 27th, 2013, 2:17 pm

glnc222 wrote:LBA-1 Balancer ...component costs
Cost of components in the parts list for four circuits, if on perfboard say, is $27-30 at Digi-Key --
DigiKey's stock is zero for the LM3420AM5X-4.2 IC.

By using http://www.octopart.com to search for elex parts I see only this source for the LM3420AM5X-4.2:
"Rochester Electronics LM3420AM5X-4.2/NOPB ·· avail:17,730". No unit cost is shown, hence Rochester may be wholesale only(?).
Might be able to put battery clips on a 2-unit perfboard as well.
Before building hardware be sure to investigate the influence of contact-resistance of spring-force battery contacts for handling two amps current. The resultant voltage drop across each tiny resistance may sum up to enough voltage loss across battery terminals that it reduces the robot's running time.
Gordon
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4304
Joined: April 6th, 2005, 2:02 am
Location: Santa Ynez, CA USA

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 27th, 2013, 3:27 pm

Probably even more reasons not to use clips. Someone said you need to wrap the thermistor against the cells with shrink wrap to get proper readings.
Cost was just an estimate, figured available somewhere when missing at Digi-Key.

Interesting a Roomba LiOn pack should have everything in it to use with Neato except for separation of the pack into two halves. The Roomba needs specialized hardware charging devices for the LiOn as much as Neato. There are likely more wires running between cells and a charge controller. Theoretically one could separate the Roomba pack parts and run some wires across the bottom of the Neato between the two battery compartments.

The fire hazard associated with incorrect LiOn use makes it inconvenient to experiment with this type of circuit without full knowledge of the charging function's loop-de-loops. Not the best place for trial-and-error.

Maybe there will be more Neato packs offered out of Germany. Post inquiries in the German forum, using google's translator (though you may come out writing like Yoda).
Last edited by glnc222 on December 27th, 2013, 3:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby vic7767 » December 27th, 2013, 3:35 pm

I've ordered some 4 amp LI-ion cells (4ea) and two Power control boards with the balancer function from a seller in China via ebay. Will see what happens within the Neato next year.
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 14917
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 27th, 2013, 3:37 pm

Note Hausman/Taler's remark about adding an additional MOSFET missing from some Chinese balancer, for a bit more sophistication.
[edit] might be to load the Neato when LiOn's full; it checks status by trying to charge, always some current with Nickel, none Lithium. Not a normal LiOn charger feature so might have to add. Voltage controlled switch, shut off below charging voltage, at lower discharge level.
Last edited by glnc222 on December 27th, 2013, 9:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby vic7767 » December 27th, 2013, 3:53 pm

Yep, I'm hoping that these boards will function.
Attachments
aPCB.jpg
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 14917
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 28th, 2013, 2:25 am

Perhaps a four-cell balancer is needed instead of two 2-cell boards shown. Can these boards themselves be in series as required, compared to the two cells they handle in series? If one board shuts off when full, the other won't get charging power. The ELV boards stack in series.
There's a four cell model of that not much larger and cheaper than two of the smaller, but essentially what's in a Roomba pack again. Usable with extra wires between Neato compartments. Or you join two boards with a third board treating the first two like cells? -- would seem the same, connection wise, aside from whether functions.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby vic7767 » December 28th, 2013, 11:39 am

There is only 8.4 vdc per battery pack side. The main board controls both packs that each contain two cells 3.7vdc each. No need for 4 cells per side since you would be looking at 16.8vdc per side if they were connected in series.
Last edited by vic7767 on December 28th, 2013, 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 14917
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby mfortuna » December 28th, 2013, 12:35 pm

vic7767 wrote:There is only 8.4 vdc per battery. The main board controls both packs that each contain two cells 3.7vdc each. No need for 4 cells per side since you would be looking at 17.8vdc.


I am confused by the math.

Nominally Lithium batteries are rated at 3.7V/cell. Four cells is 14.8V, two cells is 7.4V. 8.4V is the fully charged voltage of two cells, 16.8V is the fully charged voltage of four cells.
Mike
Reds x 3, Dirt Dog, Disco (now a parts bot), Create, Scooba 350, and Security Dawg
Evolution Mint
Neato XV-11
Shark Ion 750
User avatar
mfortuna
Robot Master
 
Posts: 5843
Joined: February 5th, 2006, 10:35 am
Location: NH

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby vic7767 » December 28th, 2013, 1:48 pm

Only off by 1 vdc, good grief Mike. :?
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 14917
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 28th, 2013, 2:58 pm

Sorry my point was not sufficiently clear.
Neato has two packs comprising a single "battery" being placed in series by the existing connection wires.
Neato's system sees only the entire series of all the cells in both packs.
([edit] I would still examine more the main black power wire on the system board connector, how it gets to the battery negative on the other side. Whether Neato has any connection to one pack's half voltage.)
Separate balancer boards in each compartment's pack sees the cells in one compartment.
NiMh has 6 cells per compartment, LiOn 2 cells per compartment.
The voltage on each compartment's 2 cells in series varies, for LiOn and NiMh between around 6 full empty to around 8.4v full charged, with Neato only using down to about 7.2v, or 14.4v-16.8v for the whole set. At 14.2 (7.1v per compartment) Neato shuts down. 1/3 the capacity is never used, as a buffer against damaging excess discharge.

All four cells of two compartments must be balanced, and two compartments must be balanced against each other, I assume. The ELV balancer is attached to every cell and forms a 4-cell balancer.
The TCH boards shown by Ed are 2-cell balancers working in each compartment.

What balances the two compartments against each other?

A 4-cell TCH board can be wired to all the cells in both compartments, and balance all the cells, but only with additional wiring between compartments. The board attaches to both ends of every cell.

The 2-cell boards have two terminals representing a single composite battery or pack with a negative and positive terminal plugged into the Neato connector. The connectors are wired in series, a brown wire going around the back between the positive terminal (red wire) on one side to the negative (black wire) on the other.
A four cell board has to connect it's negative terminal to the Neato connector on one compartment, and its positive terminal to the Neato connector in the other compartment. And so on.

In addition to balancing the cells, the entire series of four cells will shut off with high impedance when fully charged when LiOn, compared to NiMh. Neato will treat this as an error condition, expecting some current to flow when applying a charging voltage to NiMh fully charged.

In the same way, when the two cells on one side fully charge, no power is passed to the other side if it is not yet fully charged, and charging is stopped incomplete and unbalanced. Unless the board includes a bypass of some sort around the fully charged cells. This is one function in the ELV balancer, separate from its charging function.

Besides this bypass, the LM3420 or equivalent charging controller provides the regulated charging voltage to each cell for the method used on LiOn cells. The bypass is supplied by an additional transistor switch.

So how do these 2-cell balancer boards work? Do they have all the functions needed?
[edit] same question applies to the TCH 4-cell for Neato errors only.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 28th, 2013, 5:38 pm

If needed, a separate bypass circuit is a lot easier to make than the complicated balancing and charging circuits for the Lithium cells. That could be left to TCH boards, cheaper than ELV's even hand made, and just make little bypass boards. A comparator, opamp, or zener controlled power transistor, can distinguish the charging from discharging voltage. Much easier to understand than convoluted charging circuits, easily tested with battery suppies and pots etc., safely separated functions not disturbing temperamental fire breathing dragon cells.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby vic7767 » December 28th, 2013, 6:03 pm

If the battery and hardware I've ordered don't perform correctly and develop charging errors we might have to visit your suggestion of an additional circuit USA built by one of us hackers on this forum. :D
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 14917
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby glnc222 » December 28th, 2013, 6:23 pm

DigiKey's stock is zero for the LM3420AM5X-4.2 IC.

Looks like the single cell version is discontinued -- even at Rochester, which lists things they are licensed to manufacture if you want...
May explain discontinuance of the ELV, because there are other single cell charge chips at Digi-Key, but would require updated support circuit and its components.
Needs an updated revision of the board, and newer fancier boards for the main applications supersede.
So we have to understand fully the ELV, a nuisance, to put it mildly. Easier to start from scratch with available balancer/chargers and peculiar Neato demands.



[edit] It looks easier to use a 4-cell charger/balancer with a small bypass for Neato's error than to bypass one pack for charging to supply to the next. That requires a high current bypass, while to satisfy Neato we just need the current it normally sends into a fully charged NiMh battery -- yet to be measured, but the ELV mentions something like 350ma.
The balancer can go in one compartment and the bypass in the other compartment.
Four 18650 in one compartment or two 26650 in each.
I would try clips given the soldering difficulty (see Gordon's comment above on limitations) Adapt CR123A clips half needed length http://www.ebay.com/itm/2x-CR123A-CR123-Lithium-Battery-Holder-Box-Clip-Case-w-PCB-Solder-Mounting-Lead-/300956735694?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item46126b58ce Wires and clips get expensive compared to ten cent resistors.

I don't see paying a lot more just to eliminate a crossing cable. The only point of the whole thing is lower costs.
It could be cheaper to supply substitute compartment covers, and when voiding the warranty they can go inside opening the case.

The maximum discharge current of 18650 cells appears to vary a lot, so the right size is needed.
Ultrafire sells various over-specified batteries, like 4000mah labeled really only 2000.
That test reporting site seems to cover every battery made, not just in the summary table, more separately; search for the particular battery.
Last edited by glnc222 on December 28th, 2013, 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
glnc222
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4911
Joined: January 23rd, 2012, 9:19 pm
Location: North Carolina, U.S.

Re: Neato lithium ion battery revisited

Postby Gordon » December 28th, 2013, 7:30 pm

Excuse me, I have a couple questions about this:
glnc222 wrote:...The TCH boards shown by Ed are 2-cell balancers ...
1) What does "TCH" stand for? I do not see that abbreviation, even in Ed's picture here: viewtopic.php?p=120555#p120555

2) What evidence is there regarding the ability of those protective PCAs (Ed's photo above) to balance cells, other than the word showing on the picture? I ask that, because components I see on the PCBs suggest to me only "protection".
Gordon
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4304
Joined: April 6th, 2005, 2:02 am
Location: Santa Ynez, CA USA

PreviousNext

Return to Neato Robotics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: ASTMedic, doublem, jdong and 273 guests