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Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: November 14th, 2016, 11:42 am
by chrisko
Can someone tell me what each wire on the battery connector does?
Or is there a diagram online?

Thanks,
Chris

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: November 14th, 2016, 12:05 pm
by vic7767
Two leads, (Red & Black) provide power, the other two leads send the thermistor values to the MCU.

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: November 14th, 2016, 2:10 pm
by glnc222
Red wire is the positive battery terminal, black negative (common practice in electronics, opposite household wiring).
The black wire on the lower voltage battery side is system ground; the lower red wire connects in the case over to the black wire on the high voltage battery, putting the two packs in series. One yellow thermistor wire also goes to system ground, the other through a resistor to the 5v internal system supply. The computer reads the junction value, varies as the passive thermistor resistance changes with temperature, falling with heating. Only the high side thermistor controls the charging process, besides emergency excess temperature conditions. NimH batteries signal full charge by heating as charging current is dissipated as heat. Lithium batteries are controlled by voltage only, and are used in the XV models with adapters simulating the temperature signal (or by setting the software to Lithium mode as described in thread Lithium Ion Revisited. Diagrams of wiring there as well with thermistor identification.

[edit] Inside the battery packs there is a self-resetting polyfuse cutting out at excess current and a thermal fuse cutting out at very high temperatures in a fire, besides a thermistor reading temperatures for the computer.

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: November 14th, 2016, 3:08 pm
by chrisko
Thanks for all that info. Has anyone made their own battery packs? Or replaced bad cells.
I'm on my 4th set of batteries and now again my neato only lasts a few minutes.

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: November 14th, 2016, 3:20 pm
by glnc222
With middleman distribution costs, it does not pay to make your own NiMh packs, which have even fallen in price over years. Many DIY lithium packs have been made, as in thread Lithium Ion Revisited. http://www.robotreviews.com/chat/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=16982&hilit=lithium+ion+revisited After-market lithium packs of high quality became available a couple years ago, from LithiumPowerInc in the U.S., AnewPow elsewhere, from a Taiwan company with long experience. Also resellers for these distributors. DIY lithium packs are most practical on the newer XV's without the side charging jack, with the newer Rev64 Binky system boards. These can be set with a USB command for lithium batteries as used by Vorwerk. The older Rev113 Cruze boards do not seem to respond to the settting commands (unpublished SetConfig BatteryType 3 for lithium). DIY lithium is best made with the newer LiNMC type cells for safety and performance.

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: November 14th, 2016, 3:29 pm
by glnc222
It may be possible to check individual cells within an NiMh pack (some members used to do such things with model planes and cars) but the packs are assembled with spot welded connectors. You could also find additional cells failing over time. Instruments are needed to test and so forth, external chargers etc. Equipped and experienced engineers even make the spot welder tools, normally a couple hundred dollars. You can solder the cells with good technique and high end tools, and some cells can be purchased with welded tabs on them for easier soldering.

Packs should last 200-300 charging cycles, and how long the bot has been used should be considered when managing the batteries. Note NiMh cells have a shelf-life problem from self-discharge, absent on lithium. This accounts for some bad replacement deliveries, as well as the conditioning initial cycling on new robots. Some such wear can be corrected, but if left too long is irreversible.

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: November 14th, 2016, 3:40 pm
by vic7767
There are some after marker vendors offering Lithium packs for your Neato. One "Lithium Power Inc" on Amazon.com offers a 1 year warranty on their pack set and the packs will outlast NiMH sets by a factor of 3 times as long.

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: April 6th, 2019, 10:58 pm
by tabora
Can anyone confirm which of the thermistor wires goes to ground? Is it the one closer to the negative (black) lead?

Re: Xv signature battery connector wires?

PostPosted: April 7th, 2019, 8:45 pm
by glnc222
XV battery pack plug pin ID's in post http://www.robotreviews.com/chat/viewtopic.php?p=122801#p122801
Image
The thermistor is connected in series to 5v through a system board resistor about 20K ohms, with the junction voltage measured by a cpu analog input. Thermistor resistance falls with increasing temperature, lowering the voltage sensed.
XV thermistors are similar to U.S. Sensor part# 103FG1K, 10K@25C.
For battery charging control, the temperature is read only from the high side battery pack (with the 15v positive terminal, negative terminal connected to the positive on the low side pack). Unlike the Botvac, the XV has two battery packs in separate compartments.