Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears etc

The very latest news and updates for the iRobot Roomba robotic vacuum, the Scooba Robotic Washer and the Dirt Dog workshop sweeper. All discussion and troubleshooting questions go here.

Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears etc

Postby Marshtown » January 5th, 2012, 8:37 am

My second Roomba 530 (Ruby) from ebayUK came lightly used for a year and looked fairly clean compared to my first 530 (Fido) from eBayUK that was filthy but works fine except for 18 minute battery life. Evidently Fido had been thrashed for longer, but, given a basic clean-up and Ruby's battery, gobbles away for an hour before asking for brushes to be cleaned; fair enough. Anyway, sensitive Ruby is the problem: at 90 seconds she always cuts out with the 2 beeps "clean my brushes" error. I have read all the manuals online, watched YouTube cleaning demos and read loads of messages on help boards such as this one. Followed it all. Stripped Ruby down and don't think I can get her much cleaner; brushes, yellow end caps, side brush, wheels front & back, CHM frame, motor shaft, inside gear box. Not a lot in the gear box - small slimy black round the spindles, not the gross hair bunches I've seen online. Tried turning the main brush for a minute - something I read. Tried just one or other brush with the side wheel assembly removed but even that minimal load on a clean laminate floor trips the error at 90 second after clicking every second. I presume that is the sound of the motor knocking as the brushes are repeatedly reversed. Ruby has a height adjuster in place. Tested Fido's CHM (which he raises no objection to even though I have not been into his main gear box and his height adjuster is missing) but Ruby still gives the error. Fido also works fine with Ruby's cleaned up CHM so, all in all, I can't see that the issue is in the CHM. What next please?
Marshtown
 
Posts: 3
Joined: January 4th, 2012, 8:55 pm

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby Gordon » January 5th, 2012, 12:51 pm

Marshtown wrote:...What next please?
Your troubleshooting tests allude to Ruby having suffered a shift in its ability to accurately assess main brush running current. Measurement of motor current is accomplished on the main_PCA via certain circuits and the MCU + firmware.

Your easiest tactic to compare Ruby & Fido's main-brush-current is to follow the manual BiTs procedure given in Appendix A of the Roomba 500 Service Manual. By doing that, you will see displayed on your monitor results such as in this example:
Service Manual wrote:SUMMARY: (main-brush-motor-stall?) PASS
SUMMARY: (main-brush-current-ok?) PASS mA -283 min -500 max -200 mV 15947degrees-C 37
SUMMARY: (main-brush-stall-current-ok?) PASS mA -1338 min -1400 max -1250 mV 15892 degrees-C 37
If you need help parsing those records, just say so. It is unfortunate that iRobot people made two engineering errors in they way those data are expressed.

In the example, 283mA is the measured running current, and it is well between MAX & MIN limits of 500mA & 200mA. Your Ruby may very well indicate current beyond 500mA and possibly approaching the MIN limit of 1250mA stall-current.

By doing the main-brush BiT on both Fido & Ruby, but using the same CHM in each, you can compare the reported running currents to determine whether Ruby is suffering a main_PCA fault. If such is the case, your only recourse (I am sensing you are not EE capable) will be to buy a harvested main_PCA for Ruby and switch new for old.
Gordon
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4099
Joined: April 6th, 2005, 2:02 am
Location: Santa Ynez, CA USA

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby Jubo » January 6th, 2012, 3:08 am

You mentioned yellow end cap, how about the yellow bearing?
Jubo
Robot Addict
 
Posts: 230
Joined: August 8th, 2009, 8:31 am

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby Marshtown » January 6th, 2012, 9:05 am

Thanks but yes, sorry thats what I meant, two yellow bearings and spindles cleaned.
Marshtown
 
Posts: 3
Joined: January 4th, 2012, 8:55 pm

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby iMayne » January 6th, 2012, 10:37 am

Try running Ruby's battery and CHM in Fido and tell us the outcome. Run the fully charged battery until it's dead. To do this simply hit the dock button but unplug any docking station.
UK Business Coming Soon
User avatar
iMayne
Robot Addict
 
Posts: 612
Joined: September 1st, 2010, 7:56 am
Location: Birmingham, UK

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby vic7767 » January 6th, 2012, 11:18 am

Jubo wrote:You mentioned yellow end cap, how about the yellow bearing?


There are no ball-bearings used on the two cleaning brushes in the brush deck component of the Cleaning Head Module. But, there are sintered-bronze bushings installed in the yellow end caps.

I agree with Gordons assessment.
Attachments
bushings.gif
Last edited by vic7767 on January 6th, 2012, 6:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/

http://www.Robot-Doc.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 11726
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby mfortuna » January 6th, 2012, 11:30 am

Yes they are not bearings but that is what Irobot refers to them as. If you told someone to check the yellow bushings you would probably get a "Huh?"
Mike
Reds x 3, Dirt Dog, Disco (now a parts bot), Create, Scooba 350, and Security Dawg
Evolution Mint
Neato XV-11
User avatar
mfortuna
Robot Master
 
Posts: 5141
Joined: February 5th, 2006, 10:35 am
Location: NH

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby iMayne » January 6th, 2012, 11:47 am

Agreed. They are also called Brush Bearings/Caps. But I don't know why iRobot uses the word "bearings".
UK Business Coming Soon
User avatar
iMayne
Robot Addict
 
Posts: 612
Joined: September 1st, 2010, 7:56 am
Location: Birmingham, UK

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby Gordon » January 6th, 2012, 1:13 pm

iMayne wrote:... But I don't know why iRobot uses the word "bearings".
They are called "bearing" because sleeve-bearings, or bushing style bearings support one end of both main brushes.

The really screwy name being used by iRobot in its documentation is "Brush Caps", which is almost totally indecipherable (or easily confused with Brush Bearings)! However, if everyone would simply refer to their Roomba Owner's Manual, the Anatomy pages display the names that iRobot has applied to many of Roombas externally visible components. See here:
page-6_btm-vw500anatomy.jpg

In that figure we see that "Brush Caps" refer to the slip-on yellow (usually) discs which are the rotating elements of a single stage labyrinth seal. Its static elements are provided by the Brush Guard and "Brush Deck" (a name not used by iRobot for the 500 series).

We have read reports in rr about those yellow discs rubbing against adjacent brush deck surfaces to cause additional load on the brush motor. However, I don't think this applies to Marshtown's Ruby, because he shifted Fido's operational CHM to Ruby and experienced the same shut down.
Gordon
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4099
Joined: April 6th, 2005, 2:02 am
Location: Santa Ynez, CA USA

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby Gordon » January 6th, 2012, 1:24 pm

I would agree with these two sentences...
vic7767 wrote:...There are no bearings used on the two cleaning brushes in the brush deck component of the Cleaning Head Module. There are two brass bushings installed in the "Yellow End Caps". ...
...IF they had been worded this way:

There are no ball-bearings used on the two cleaning brushes in the brush deck component of the Cleaning Head Module. But, there are sintered-bronze bushings installed in the yellow end caps.
Gordon
Robot Master
 
Posts: 4099
Joined: April 6th, 2005, 2:02 am
Location: Santa Ynez, CA USA

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby Marshtown » January 8th, 2012, 8:04 pm

@imayne: I am running Ruby's battery routinely in Fido as his was near dead and hers is good. Ruby's CHM runs fine in Fido. Which is why I am anticipating her fault is on the PCB, as per Gordon & Vic's replies.

I wonder if I would be better to do that CHM swap permanently as Fido's CHM has NO HEIGHT ADJUSTMENT CABLE (and no red dot) whereas Ruby's does. Both CHM's work in Fido. Will Fido's one without the cable be dragging more of my short-pile carpet off than appropriate, which is why so much fluff is collected? Does the cable really matter?
Marshtown
 
Posts: 3
Joined: January 4th, 2012, 8:55 pm

Re: Roomba 530 brushes error persists after cleaning gears e

Postby vic7767 » January 8th, 2012, 8:20 pm

It would appear that the CHMs are not at fault but the current sensor on the Roomba with the error is defective.

The deck height adjustment cable is necessary to prevent the brush motor from over heating when running on carpet.
Roomba and Neato Mods, come visit: http://www.vic7767.com/

http://www.Robot-Doc.com/
User avatar
vic7767
Robot Master
 
Posts: 11726
Joined: January 14th, 2006, 8:31 pm
Location: Haughton Louisiana - USA


Return to iRobot Roomba and Scooba Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Fraggboy, Rar9, vic7767 and 249 guests